Dr. Michio Kaku:
I will bring on our first special guest who is Professor Stuart Samuel, professor of theoretical physics at City College of New York.

So many times science books have been criticized because they're dry, they're boring, they're impersonal. And yet religious books have a certain dynamism -- they're are full of stories and anecdotes and colorful language and poetry. And the question is why can't science be expressed in the language of faith and yet still be scientifically rigorous. Of course in the past, many artists and poets have been fascinated by the drama of the Universe. Vincent van Gogh, of course, tried to capture this mystery -- this fascination -- in his work Starry, Starry Night.

[music: lyrics related to Vincent van Gogh's Starry, Starry Night]

Well throughout our history, poets, spiritualists, [ah] theologians have had a monopoly in terms of using the language of faith -- the rhythms and poetry of faith -- to express their point of view while scientists have been criticized as being sterile. Well that's why we have our next guest Professor Samuel, who is a colleague of mine at the City College of New York. And he's been part of a rather ambitious project. He is one of the editors of a book called The Bible According to Einstein. That's right, The Bible According to Einstein, which is sort like a fresh new look at science and religion.

And Dr. Samuel, first of all, could you first explain to us the theme of The Bible According to Einstein?

Professor Samuel:
Well, if I were to try to describe The Bible According to Einstein in one sentence I would say that it's "nature and science in a biblical format."

You know, several millennia ago, religions emerged as powerful influences in people's lives. Indeed, today they continue to be so. Also a few millennia ago appeared the sacred books basic to the world's major religions. An example is the Holy Bible. These sacred books, for the most part, deal with issues of morality, human behavior, judgment and spirituality.

During the last [pause] past few centuries, another powerful force has arisen that greatly affects people. It is science and the technology that it brings. Science deals with a domain that is quite different from religion. Science is a description of the physical world, the things we see, hear and touch. So much progress has been made in our knowledge of nature, that it is fair to say that the age of scientific enlightenment is here. But lacking has been a book -- like the Holy Bible -- to represent science and nature. The Bible According to Einstein was written to fill this need. It is in some sense "the bible for the third millennium, the bible of science."

Sheldon Glashow (who is at Harvard) and who won the Nobel prize in physics, supports this idea. He described The Bible According to Einstein as "A cosmic history and a bible for our times."

It is a tribute to the Holy Bible that this science bible should emulate the Holy Bible in style and in structure. [Ah] The Bible According to Einstein has an "old testament" and a "new testament." The old testament narrates the history of the Universe, Earth and life, from the Big Bang beginning to the emergence of Homo sapiens. The new testament presents the laws of nature and [ah] deals with some other issues such as man's intellectual and spiritual developments. Much of the text is written in a rhythmic language that approaches verse by the way.

You should know when I first saw this book, I said to myself that I had to get involved with it. When I read the "old testament," it was such an enlightening experience. To witness the ENTIRE history of the Universe, Earth and life is (I'm not sure how to explain it) [pause] breathtaking. I actually read the "old testament" of The Bible According to Einstein five times. The effects it had on me still persisted with the fifth reading.

Your listeners will probably want an example of the type of thing that I found enlightening.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
Well, let's [ah] start with the Book of Genesis [of the Holy Bible]. [Ah] The Book of Genesis has the creation myth. And cosmology today has the pretenses of being a precise science. So could you explain to us about how your book deals with the question of creation. The Bible starts with the mist, that is, comic darkness. And we think that the sky, the Universe was always dark. Could you explain what modern science has to say about that?

Professor Samuel:
Well, as you know, Dr. Kaku, we have a very good understanding of how the Universe began. It began with the Big Bang. [Ah] Many of your listeners probably know this. During this period, the Universe was extremely hot: light and energy were everywhere. [If I] [pause] If I may quote from The Bible According to Einstein. [pause] Let me see. Here. Yes. It says, "The fog of light did fog the 'sight' - it was a bath of light too bright to see; the World was blinded by its own brilliant light."

Dr. Michio Kaku:
So in other words the darkness that we associate with the blackness of outer space wasn't darkness at all?

Professor Samuel:
[Ah] Well. [Ah] During this early time, the Universe was full of energy and there was an enormous amount of light. During this time, the very fabric of space was expanding. Actually this expansion has continued throughout cosmic history and is still happening today. Now when a system expands, it cools. You have to remember that the very early Universe was very hot. So as the Universe expanded and evolved, its temperature when down. Eventually, the Universe cooled sufficiently so that atoms could form. To be more precise, electrons which were in the hot cosmic bath, joined with protons, which were also in the hot cosmic bath, to form neutral atoms. This event, which is known as Recombination and which happened when the Universe was about 300,000 years old, produced a tremendous flash of light. "Let there be light. And there was light," are appropriate words to describe Recombination.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
So, in other words, before 300,000 years after the Big Bang, matter as we know it didn't really exist. Atoms as we know it didn't exist.

Professor Samuel:
It was just too hot.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
It was too hot.

And then after 300,000 years, atoms began to form and then the so called blackness of outer space began to form as well?

Professor Samuel:
Well, a little bit later. What happened was that, as the Universe expanded, the wavelength of the light was stretched. This caused the visible light to become infrared radiation. By the way, nowadays, the wavelength has been stretched so much that the radiation has become microwaves and is known as the cosmic background microwave radiation -- something that I'm sure was discussed on your program before.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
The so-called echo of the Big Bang.

Professor Samuel:
Exactly. This radiation was first detected by scientists in 1965. Anyway, coming back to the history .   .   .

Dr. Michio Kaku:
And in fact, it was a graduate of City College who made that discovery, Arno Penzias as well as Dr. Wilson.

Professor Samuel:
That's right. Exactly.

Anyway, coming back to the history of the cosmos, the Universe went completely black when it was about 1,000,000 years old. And it remained completely dark for millions of years. There was no light at all -- it was infrared radiation. It wasn't until hundreds of millions of years had passed that clouds of atoms, dust and gas began to collapse to form the first stars. This must have been a particularly wonderful event in cosmic history. Soon collections of stars and galaxies appeared. Perhaps, I should [ah] read a paragraph from The Bible According to Einstein that
Dr. Michio Kaku:
Yes, go ahead.
Professor Samuel:
describes what happened. The is the from the [ah] the first chapter of the fifteenth book of creation, called Galactic Birth. The fourteenth book of creation had depicted the formation of a star, and this section continues the story.

"Chapter I: A Galaxy Is Born.
    And within two-hundred-thousand light years of the new-born star, other dense clouds collapsed and glowed. And each year, a hundred new such stars appeared. And after millions of years, there were several hundred million stars. And if ye had been there, it would have looked like unto a city in the evening, seen from far away: Initially, a few lights turned on. Then more. Then still more. And gradually spots of lights filled what once had been black void. And this collection of stars was provided with a name -- the name was galaxy. A galaxy was born."

So what you had was a black Universe in the year 1,000,000. And gradually, tiny specks of light (which we call stars) turned on, so that after a few billion years, the Universe was filled with tiny lights.

Now in some sense the Universe is still dark. This is what you mentioned before. The stars in the Universe are quite spread out, so that most of the Universe is in fact black. We happen to live on a planet not so far from a star, a star we call the Sun. So when our part of the Earth faces that Sun, we have light. And this makes us think that there is a lot of light in the Universe. Our superficial impression is that there is 50% light and 50% darkness since half the time it is day and half the time it is night. But in reality, the Universe is now dark, whereas during the Big Bang it was brilliantly bright with light.

The first chapter of The Bible According to Einstein's The Gospel According to the Gospels, which deals with one aspect of man's spiritual development, describes this. And maybe I should read this.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
Yes, go on.

Professor Samuel:
    "For the Universe, there was only one day and one night. And that one day lasted for the first three-hundred-thousand years. And it has been night ever since. It has been night for the last fifteen-billion years or so. And do not be confused by the illusion of the Sun. Even now there is only night for the Universe. The day ye see each day is a day created by the Earth's rotation. When thy part of the Earth faces the Sun, ye see the Sun and ye have day. And when thy part of the Earth turns away from the Sun, ye have night and ye see the Universe as it is. And it is dark and black. Thus the dark and black of night is the dark and black of the Universe.
    And to light the night a star was made. But the Universe was vast and very black. And the star only lit a very tiny part of the gigantic Universe. And so stars were made in great numbers and assembled in huge galaxies. But the Universe was still vast and very black. And each galaxy only lit a very tiny part of the Universe. Thus galaxies were made in great numbers. And the galaxies lit the Universe but dimly.
    And the Universe, which is vast and dark and black, was, is and shall be dimly lit by the stars and galaxies which Nature made."

Dr. Michio Kaku:
Well, Professor Samuel, do you think that [ah] this approach of yours, that is, putting science in the format of the Bible, do you think that it could have an impact on science education in the country given the fact that science education is at an abysmal low with [ah] most graduates -- even at Harvard -- being basically scientifically illiterate? Do you think that a fresh new approach is required?

Professor Samuel:
I think that this approach can appeal to people in the humanities because of, as you might have noticed, the rhythmic language. It is written [ah] in a way that has a chance to appeal to people [ah] that study English, history . . . It's a wonderful language that it is written in. And I think it's the non-scientist that needs to know more about science. Science education is so important. We need to understand how the world works. Science provides us, in part, with the knowledge to better conduct our lives. If, for example, a person bases decisions on astrology, then that person will make random actions that can lead to a less productive life. El Nino, biological cloning, electronic chips, Earth's ozone layer, the solar system, nuclear power, viruses -- we need to know these things.

The Bible According to Einstein provides a great opportunity to learn much about science and nature. You don't need to take my word for this. Yolanda Moses, president of the American Anthropological Association and president of the City College of New York, a woman devoted to excellence in education said that "The Bible According to Einstein is an amazing feat that makes nature's laws understandable even to the non-scientist." And Samuel Ting at MIT who is a Nobel laureate in physics, said that "The Bible According to Einstein is a fascinating book, MOST EDUCATIONAL [emphasized]. I have learned a great deal from it." And Glenn T. Seaborg, another Nobel laureate but in chemistry, made the following comment: "This imaginative book traces the history of the Universe and humankind, seen through the eyes of science and told in the language of faith. Ultimately, it provides a marvelous opportunity to learn a lot of science and enjoy it." [last phrase said slowly with emphasis]

Dr. Michio Kaku:
Now Professor Samuel, I understand that you are going to be doing several readings in the New York area. Could you tell us exactly when they are and what you are going to talk about in these readings?

Professor Samuel:
Ah, yes. Listeners may want to get a pen and write down the information. Each event, by the way, will be different so that one could come to all of them.

On Thursday, February 19, at 6:00 pm at Borders Books at 5 World Trade Center, there will be a reading of the Book of Prophets of The Bible According to Einstein under the title "Predictions for the Next 100 Billion Years." The chapters of this Book of Prophets provide predictions that will definitely or almost definitely happen based on scientific knowledge.

There is one example that your listeners in California might enjoy hearing. Let me read this. [Ah]

"Chapter VII [pause] of The Book of Prophets called Micah.
    And the king asked the sixth prophet, whose name was Micah, 'What will happen within ten-million years from now?' And Micah answered, saying, 'It shall come to pass that Baja California and a slither of southwestern California will have drifted north and be a long island off the west coast of the United States. And Los Angeles will be west of Sacramento. And Tijuana, Mexico, will be west of Fresno, California.'"

Let me explain [ah] what is going on here. The surface of the Earth is covered by about a dozen large sheets called tectonic plates. These plates act like units moving slowly over the asthenosphere, or Earth's upper layer of the outer mantle. The plates move about much like giant icebergs in a crowded sea. Now the west coast of California is part of the Pacific tectonic plate, while the rest of California is part of the North American tectonic plate. The dividing line between the two plates forms the San Adreas faults. The Pacific plate is drifting north a few centimeters each year. Once in a while, this plate suddenly inches forth and an earthquake occurs. During millions of years, tectonic plates can move significant distances. This explains why Los Angeles will be one day west of Sacramento.

This movement will actually continue. Let me read from Chapter VIII of The Bible According to Einstein's Book of Prophets:
    "And the king asked the seventh prophet, whose name was Nahum, 'What will happen within a hundred-million years from now?' And Nahum answered, saying, 'It shall come to pass that Baja California and Los Angeles will have slid into the Aleutian trench south of Alaska. And they will be drawn into the lower crust and disappear. And Baja California and Los Angeles will be lost. And above them will be mountains. And the mountains will be like unto tombstones -- testimony of their demise.'"

Dr. Michio Kaku:
Now Professor Samuel I understand that you have a book of Catastrophes and a book of the Cretaceous talking about asteroids and dinosaurs.

Professor Samuel:
That's right. The next reading event of The Bible According to Einstein takes place on Friday, February 20th at 7:00 pm at Tower Books, which is at 383 Lafayette Street. The title of that presentation is "Black Plague! Can It Happen Again?" And this is a reading from Chapter III of the Bible According to Einstein's Book of Catastrophes.

The black plague struck in the fourteenth century and kill almost one-hundred million people worldwide, about one fifth the world's population. This is the only time during recorded history where the human population decreased. This chapter of The Bible According to Einstein narrates an account of history's most devastating sickness.

And the third reading event will take place on Saturday, February 28 at 12 noon at the Logos Bookstore at 1575 York Avenue. By the way, Logos is one of the nice independent neighborhood bookstores located in the Yorkville area of Manhattan. The title of that book presentation will be "The Demise of the Dinosaurs." As you know Dr. Kaku, 65 million years ago an asteroid struck Earth causing widespread ecological damage and killing off the dinosaurs. I think you discussed this on your program before.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
That's right.

Professor Samuel:
The attendees of this presentation will have an opportunity to relive this experience as the details of this story are told. It was an important event in geo-history. Without this asteroid impact disaster, dinosaurs and reptiles instead of humans might be ruling the Earth today.

All these reading events are free. And [cough] readers will be able to obtain signed copies of The Bible According to Einstein.

By the way, the book has been printed in only a limited edition, so that it is currently available just in New York. Listeners outside of New York can obtain copies of The Bible According to Einstein through the internet at Amazon.com.

Dr. Michio Kaku:
And any final comments you may have concerning your book The Bible According to Einstein, a novel attempt to recast science in the language of faith?

Professor Samuel:
[Ah] The Bible According to Einstein aims to create a greater consciousness about the cosmos, Earth and life. It provides the opportunity of enlightenment through the discovery of how nature works. Our understanding of the physical world during the last few decades has increased tremendously. In some sense, the Second Coming is coming; but it is science that is coming.

[music again: lyrics related to Vincent van Gogh's Starry, Starry Night]

Dr. Michio Kaku:
And that concludes our interview with my colleague Professor Stuart Samuel, professor of theoretical physics at City College of New York.